>>> FROM MAJOR MERGERS TO THE UNPRECEDENTED CUTS TO FUNDING FOR PUBLIC BROADCASTERS.

THE U.S.

MEDIA LANDSCAPE HAS BEEN UNDERGOING DRAMATIC SHIFTS.

OLIVER DARCY JOINS MICHEL MARTIN.

THEY SPOKE BEFORE REPORTS THAT WARNER BROTHERS DISCOVERY HAD REJECTED PARAMOUNT SKY DANCE'S INITIAL TAKEOVER BID.

>> THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING >> IT'S A PLEASURE TO BE HERE.

>> WE'VE CALLED YOU BECAUSE THERE'S BEEN A FLURRY OF HEADLINES ABOUT THE MEDIA IN THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS.

I MEAN, THE SUSPENSION OF JIMMY KIMMEL, PUTTING JIMMY KIMMEL BACK ON THE AIR.

TALK OF A MERGER BETWEEN THE PARENT COMPANIES OF CBS AND CNN, NEW LEADERSHIP AT CBS.

LOOKING AT THIS WHOLE MENU OF THINGS YOU'VE BEEN COVERING, WHAT ARE SOME OF THE MOST IMPORTANT HEADLINES WE SHOULD BE AWARE OF?

>> THERE IS A LOT GOING ON RIGHT NOW.

I THINK THE BIG STORY RIGHT NOW IN MEDIA IS CONSOLIDATION, MERGERS, AND THE POLITICAL PRESSURE THESE COMPANIES ARE UNDER.

THAT'S KIND OF THE THROUGH-LINE YOU'RE SEEING RIGHT NOW.

A LOT OF THESE MEDIA COMPANIES WANT TO GET BIGGER SO THEY CAN COMPETE WITH THE BIG TECH TITANS, AND TO DO THAT THEY HAVE TO DO DEALS, AND THOSE DEALS NEED TO BE GENERALLY APPROVED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

THAT'S GIVEN DONALD TRUMP AND HIS ADMINISTRATION A LOT OF LEVERAGE TO EXTRACT DEMANDS YOU'RE SEEING THIS MANIFEST IN DIFFERENT WAYS.

ONE WAS JIMMY KIMMEL'S SUSPENSION.

THAT'S BECAUSE THE FCC CHAIRMAN THREATENED BASICALLY THE STATION GROUPS THAT RUN THE ABC, THEY OWNED ABC AFFILIATES, AND THEY HAVE A BIG DEAL BEFORE THE GOVERNMENT, A $6.2 BILLION DEAL THEY WANT BRENDAN CARR TO APPROVE.

YOU MENTIONED I BELIEVE WHAT'S GOING ON OVER AT PARAMOUNT WITH CBS AND CBS NEWS.

AND THAT WAS ANOTHER DEAL THAT REQUIRED BRENDAN CARR'S FCC APPROVAL.

SO YOU SAW A NUMBER OF CONCESSIONS MADE TO THIS ADMINISTRATION, WHETHER IT WAS PLACING A MAGA FOLLOWER, HE'LL REVIEW COMPLAINTS OF BIAS TO A NUMBER OF OTHER CHANGES THAT WERE MADE, AND SOME PEOPLE WOULD SAY THE CANCELLATION OF STEPHEN COLBERT WAS RELATED TO GETTING THIS DEAL DONE.

THESE COMPANIES NEED TO DO DEALS.

THE GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO APPROVE THESE DEALS, AND THEY'RE REALLY THEN AT THE MERCY OF THE GOVERNMENT, AND THEY ARE MAKING CONCESSIONS THAT ARE IMPACTING HOW WE, YOU KNOW, CONSUME INFORMATION AND HOW THE CULTURE IS SHAPED.

>> SO THERE'S NEW LEADERSHIP AT CBS.

BARI WEISS HAS BEEN INSTALLED AS THE EDITOR IN CHIEF OF CBS NEWS.

FIRST OF ALL, TELL US ABOUT WHO SHE IS AND WHAT ARE HER QUALIFICATIONS FOR THIS JOB.

>> YEAH.

SHE'S AN INTERESTING MEDIA FIGURE.

IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO PUT HER IN A POLITICAL BOX.

I WOULD SAY SHE IS SOMEONE WHO IS VERY ANTI-DEI, RIGHT?

SHE'S ANTI-WOKE.

NOT REALLY SURE HOW TO DESCRIBE HER OTHER THAN THAT.

SHE'S STAUNCHLY PRO-ISRAEL.

SHE'S TAKEN A NUMBER OF VERY, YOU KNOW, PASSIONATE STANCES, AND I THINK SHE TYPICALLY ENDS UP LINING UPMOSTLY WITH OR CROSSING OVER MOSTLY WITH THOSE ON THE RIGHT.

NOW, SHE DOES CRITICIZE THE EXCESSES OF DONALD TRUMP.

IF YOU'RE TO READ THE FREE PRESS.

>> THE FREE PRESS BEING THIS OUTLET SHE STARTED WHEN SHE BROKE WITH THE NEW YORK TIMES.

WHAT WAS THE FREE PRESS SUPPOSED TO DO?

>> IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE A PLACE, THE WAY SHE BRANDS IT IS A PLACE FOR CONTRARY THOUGHT WHERE THEY ASK TOUGH QUESTIONS, TALK ABOUT THINGS PEOPLE ARE SECRETLY TALKING ABOUT BUT TOO AFRAID TO SAY IN THE PAGES OF NEW YORK TIMES OR CABLE TELEVISION.

THEY WERE GOING TO BE THE HOME TO REAL DEBATE AND WIDE, IDEOLOGICAL SPECTRUM OF VIEWS.

THAT'S HOW SHE'S BRANDED THE FREE PRESS.

I THINK THAT'S WHERE IT'S, SHE LIKES TO I THINK PRETEND THAT THERE ARE TWO EQUAL EXTREMES IN THIS COUNTRY.

ONE ON THE LEFT AND ONE ON THE RIGHT.

I THINK THAT'S NOT ACCURATE.

>> HER NEW BOSS, DAVID ELLISON COMES FROM A FAMILY WITH ITS OWN CLEAR IDEOLOGICAL TIES.

I MEAN, DAVID'S DAD LARRY OF TECH MOGUL, THE SINGLE LARGEST PRIVATE DONOR, FRIENDS OF THE IDF, WHICH HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO DO, BUT WAS SHE BROUGHT IN TO REFLECT THE WORLD VIEW OF THESE NEW OWNERS?

WAS SHE BROUGHT IN TO DO SOMETHING ELSE?

>> YEAH.

I THINK THAT DAVID ELLISON, WHO'S NOW THE CHAIRMAN AND CEO OF PARAMOUNT, I THINK HE VERY MUCH LIKES WHAT HE THINKS THAT BARI WEISS STANDS FOR.

HE LIKES HER PRO-ISRAEL VIEWS I'M SURE, BUT I ALSO THINK THAT THERE'S THIS PERCEPTION OF CBS NEWS AS BEING TOO FAR ON THE LEFT AMONGST THE OWNERSHIP NOW.

AND THEY, I THINK BARI WEISS WAS BROUGHT IN TO MOVE THE COMPANY TO THE RIGHT.

AND THEY WOULD SAY, THEY WOULD PROBABLY DISPUTE THAT.

THEY WOULD SAY WE WANT TO MOVE IT TO THE MIDDLE.

BUT YOU KNOW, THEY'RE MOVING IT IN MORE PRO-TRUMP-FRIENDLY WATERS.

>> SO FOR THE RECORD, PARAMOUNT DAVID ELLISON ISSUED A SAYING WEISS WILL SHAPE EDITORIAL PRIORITIES, CHAMPION CORE VALUES ACROSS PLATFORMS, AND LEAD INNOVATION IN HOW THE ORGANIZATION REPORTS AND DELIVERS THE NEWS.

UNQUOTE.

HAS SHE GIVEN ANY INDICATION OF HOW SHE PLANS TO PROCEED?

>> SHE HAS SAID SHE THINKS BOTH POLITICAL PARTIES NEED TO BE SCRUTINIZED EQUALLY.

THAT GOES BACK TO WHAT I WAS SAYING.

I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE SOME REALLY BOTH SIDE-ISMS AND THIS FALSE EQUIVALENT THAT THE LEFT IS EQUALLY AS EXTREME AS THE RIGHT.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE AFRAID TO CRITICIZE DONALD TRUMP, BUT WE'RE GOING TO CRITICIZE THE AOCs OF THE WORLD OR THE ZORANS OF THE WORLD, WHAT THEY WOULD PORTRAY AS AN EQUAL EXTREME.

I DON'T THINK THAT'S ACCURATE.

IN TERMS OF HER EXPERTISE ON BUILDING A BUSINESS, YOU KNOW, TO HER CREDIT SHE HAS, SHE WAS A WRITER OF THE NEW YORK TIMES.

SHE HAD AN ENTREPRENEURIAL SPIRIT.

SHE STARTED THE FREE PRESS, WHICH SOLD FOR $150 MILLION TO SHE DID BUILD THAT.

I THINK THEY'RE SAYING SHE HAS THE BUSINESS BACKGROUND TO ALSO RUN THIS COMPANY.

I THINK MOST PEOPLE, THOUGH, WOULD SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THE SIZE OF CBS NEWS, THE LEGACY OF CBS NEWS, SHE'S WAY OUT OF HER LEAGUE.

YOU KNOW, RUNNING A SUB-STACK WITH A FEW DOZEN EMPLOYEES IS MUCH DIFFERENT THAN RUNNING CBS NEWS, WHICH IS HUNDREDS OF EMPLOYEES, IF NOT THOUSANDS, AND HAS A STORIED LEGACY.

YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT 60 MINUTES AND SOME OF THE MOST PRESTIGIOUS PROGRAMS IN ALL OF NEWS THAT SHE'S GOING TO OVERSEE AS THE EDITORIAL HEAD THERE.

WHETHER SHE HAS THE EXPERIENCE, I'M NOT SURE ANYONE THINKS SHE'S ACTUALLY QUALIFIED FOR THIS.

>> DAVID ELLISON BENEFITING FROM HIS FATHER LARRY'S FORTUNE FROM ORACLE TO ACQUIRE PARAMOUNT, WHICH OWNS CBS.

THE FATHER-SON DUO ARE EYEING WARNER BROTHERS DISCOVERY.

THIS PROGRAM AIRS AND HBO.

HOW WOULD THAT WORK?

>> I THINK THAT'S DEFINITELY THE PLAN.

MY UNDERSTANDING FROM TALKING TO PEOPLE FA FAMILIAR WITH THE MATTER, IT INCLUDES THE WARNER BROTHERS STUDIO THAT MAKES THE FILM, IT INCLUDES HBO AND HBO MAX, TURNER SPORTS, WHICH IS TBS AND TNT.

IF YOU'RE WATCHING BASEBALL RIGHT NOW, YOU'RE PROBABLY WATCHING ON ONE OF THOSE CHANNELS.

AND IT ALSO INCLUDES CNN.

THE IDEA WOULD BE THEY WOULD MERGE, PARAMOUNT PLUS WITH HBO MAX.

THEY WOULD HAVE CBS SPORTS MERGE WITH TURNER SPORTS.

AND CNN MERGE WITH CBS NEWS.

WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE?

YOU NO LONGER NEED A CBS FOREIGN BUREAU BECAUSE YOU CAN RELY ON CNN'S NEWS-GATHERING MUSCLE TO POWER CBS NEWS.

I THINK WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IMMEDIATELY WOULD BE LAYOFFS BECAUSE THERE WOULD BE SYNERGY.

YOU WOULD ELIMINATE THE DUPLICATIONS.

CONTROL THE EDITORIAL OUTPUT OF NOT ONLY CBS NEWS BUT ALSO CNN.

AND THAT WOULD GIVE HER AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF CONTROL OVER HOW WE ABSORB INFORMATION, YOU KNOW, TODAY.

AND I THINK DONALD TRUMP WOULD CERTAINLY LOVE NOTHING MORE THAN THE ELLISONS AND BARI WEISS TO BE IN CONTROL OF CNN BECAUSE, AS YOU KNOW, THAT HAS BEEN PERHAPS HIS, YOU KNOW, THE ONE NEWS OUTLET HE HAS LIKED TO BEAT UP ON THE MOST OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS.

>> ADD A FURTHER WRINKLE.

TikTok POPULAR WITH LOTS OF PEOPLE FOR NEWS, COOKING, DANCING, THE WHOLE THING.

KIND OF A WORLDWIDE SUPER PLAYER WAS FORCED TO CHANGE HANDS BECAUSE OF U.S.

FEARS CHINA COULD USE IT TO SHAPE AMERICAN PUBLIC OPINION.

AND NOW IT'S LIKELY THAT LARRY ELLISON'S COMPANY ORACLE IS ALSO LIKELY TO HAVE A STAKE IN TikTok AS WELL.

SO THAT WOULD BE LANDSCAPE, MEDIA SORT OF REAL ESTATE CONTROLLED BY THIS FAMILY.

>> WHEN YOU'RE FRIENDS WITH DONALD TRUMP, HE GIVES YOU GIFTS.

AND TikTok IS A NICE GIFT FOR THE ELLISONS.

NOW, TO BE FAIR TO THEM, THEY HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS WITH TikTok FOR A WHILE.

ORACLE HOUSES OTHER SERVERS FOR U.S.

TikTok.

THERE'S THIS WHOLE THING CALLED PROJECT TEXAS, BUT REMEMBER THEY WANTED THE DATA OUT OF CHINA AND THE U.S.

ORACLE IS HOW HE'S SO WEALTHY, HAS BEEN WORKING WITH TikTok ON THAT FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS, BUT CERTAINLY THIS IS A BENEFIT OF BEING FRIENDS WITH THE PRESIDENT.

LARRY ELLISON IS A DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER.

HE'S AN ALLY OF THE PRESIDENT.

YOU SEE HIM AT THE WHITE HOUSE OCCASIONALLY.

I THINK DONALD TRUMP WOULD LOVE NOTHING MORE THAN TO HAND OVER THE KEYS TO A LOT OF THESE MEDIA COMPANIES TO AN ALLY, RIGHT?

HE WOULD LIKE TikTok TO BE IN HIS COURT.

HE FOR A LONG TIME FELT LIKE HIM.

AND FOR THE FIRST TIME NOW HE HAS MARK ZUCKERBERG UNDER HIS THUMB.

TIM COOK OVER AT APPLE HANDED HIM THE GOLDEN PLAQUE.

JEFF BEZOS IS MOVING IN HIS DIRECTION.

AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, THE TECH COMPANIES ARE NOW IN HIS COURT, AND I THINK HE VERY MUCH ENJOYS THAT BECAUSE HE UNDERSTANDS THE POWER OF THE TECH COMPANIES AND THE POWER OF THE MEDIA COMPANIES.

IF THEY CAN NO LONGER BE ANTAGONISTS BUT ALLIES, THAT'S A HUGE WIN FOR DONALD TRUMP AS HE WORKS TO RESHAPE THIS COUNTRY.

>> IN FAIRNESS, HAVEN'T REALLY RICH PEOPLE ALWAYS HAD KIND OF AN OUTSIZED ROLE IN WHAT KIND OF INFORMATION THAT WE CONSUME?

>> I THINK WHAT'S DIFFERENT HERE IS THAT DONALD TRUMP HAS MADE IT VERY CLEAR HE WILL WEAPONIZE GOVERNMENT TO GO AFTER CRITICS AND PUNISH CRITICS.

AND IF YOU'RE AN ALLY, HE'LL REWARD YOU WITH THINGS LIKE TikTok.

WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

IT MEANS IF JEFF BEZOS IS COMPETING WITH GOVERNMENT SERVICES OR BLUE ORIGIN, WHICH IS HIS SPACE COMPANY AGAINST SpaceX AND HE WANTS THOSE, WELL HE BETTER BE FRIENDLY WITH DONALD TRUMP.

IF HE'S NOT, THOSE CONTRACTS ARE GOING TO ELON MUSK OR SOMEWHERE ELSE, TO MICROSOFT MAYBE, WHOEVER'S FRIENDLY WITH HIM.

YOU'RE SEEING THESE BILLIONAIRE TECH OWNERS OVERTLY BEND THE KNEE, AND THIS DID NOT HAPPEN DURING THE FIRST ADMINISTRATION.

>> SO WHERE, WHERE'S THE NEWS GOING TO COME FROM?

SOME BELIEVE NATIONAL MEDIA IN PARTICULAR HAVE A LIBERAL BENT, AND THEY FEEL IT'S ENTIRELY FAIR TO HAVE ALTERNATE OUTLETS THAT PRESENT ALTERNATE POINTS OF VIEW.

DO YOU GIVE ANY CREDENCE TO THAT ARGUMENT?

>> WELL, I THINK CERTAINLY EVERYONE IS ON BOARD, I THINK, WITH HAVING DIFFERENT OUTLETS AND PROVIDE DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW.

I THINK THE PROBLEM IS THAT A LOT OF THESE OUTLETS ON THE RIGHT MAKE UP THINGS, RIGHT?

THEY'RE NOT BASING THOSE POINTS OF VIEW IN FACT.

THEY ARE OFTEN PUSHING CONSPIRACY THEORIES.

THEY ARE SPOUTING DISINFORMATION.

THEY ARE, AT THE VERY LEAST, ENGAGING A LOT OF MISINFORMATION PEDALING, AND IT TENDS TO BENEFIT THE MAN IN THE WHITE HOUSE WHO IS THE CHIEF LIAR PROBABLY, RIGHT?

HE LIES EVERY TIME HE OPENS HIS MOUTH BASICALLY.

AND SO THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

AND SO YOU'RE NOT DEALING WITH A REALITY-BASED NETWORK THAT'S JUST OFFERING A DIFFERENT POINT OF VIEW BASED ON A SIMILAR SHARED SET OF FACTS.

THEY ARE REINVENTING, THEY ARE MAKING UP FACTS, AND THEN MISINFORMING LARGE AUDIENCES.

AND SO THAT'S THE ISSUE.

>> I FEEL LIKE I NEED TO MENTION I'M SURE MANY PEOPLE PROBABLY KNOW THIS, THAT CONGRESS RECENTLY APPROVED MAJOR CUTS TO THE CORPORATION FOR PUBLIC BROADCASTING AND RESCINDED FEDERAL FUNDING FOR PBS AND NPR, PLACES I'M AFFILIATED WITH AND LOCAL STATIONS WHICH ARE NOW AT RISK.

YOU TESTIFIED BEFORE CONGRESS ABOUT SOME OF THESE ISSUES.

AND YOU SAID, YOU TALKED A DIFFICULTIES AS A SMALL PUBLISHER PROTECTING YOURSELF FROM DEFAMATION LAWSUITS.

YOU SAID THE CHILLINGEST SPEECH IS ONE OF THE FIRST SIGNS DEMOCRACY IS BEGINNING TO DECAY, WHICH ARE PRETTY STRONG WORDS.

IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT.

SO WHAT LED YOU TO THAT CONCLUSION?

WHY DO YOU SAY THAT?

>> I THINK IT'S OBVIOUS THAT WHEN ASPIRING AUTHORITARIANS ARE SEEKING TO SEIZE POWER, THEY DO NOT WANT DISSENT.

YOU SEE THIS MANIFESTING IN A NUMBER OF WAYS, WHETHER IT'S DONALD TRUMP AND HIS, YOU KNOW, FCC CHAIRMAN GOING AFTER LATE- NIGHT MEDIANS WHO MAKE FUN OF HIM, CELEBRATING THE CANCELLATION OF STEPHEN COLBERT, PRESSURING THEM TO CANCEL HIM, PRESSURING THEM TO TAKE JIMMY KIMMEL OFF THE AIR, OTHER COMEDIANS OFF THE AIR.

REPUBLICANS DEFUNDED NPR AND PBS.

WHETHER IT'S FILING LAWSUITS AGAINST OUTLETS LIKE THE NEW STREET JOURNAL, WHICH IS OWNED BY HIS ALLY RUPRT MURDOCH.

YOU ARE SEEING AN UNPRECEDENTED ASSAULT ON SPEECH IN THE COUNTRY RIGHT NOW, AND IT'S LED BY THE MAN IN THE OVAL OFFICE WHO IS SEEKING TO PUNISH CRITICS.

AND MAKE SURE THEY DO NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO CRITICIZE HIM OR TO SPEAK THEIR TRUTH ABOUT HIM.

>> HERE'S THE THING, OLIVER.

THIS IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT CRITICS OF THE MEDIA SAY.

THEY SAY AMERICANS AREN'T WATCHING, AREN'T LISTENING, AND DON'T BELIEVE US, RIGHT?

ONLY 28% OF AMERICANS EXPRESSED A GREAT DEAL OR FAIR AMOUNT OF TRUST IN NEWSPAPERS, TELEVISION, AND RADIO TO REPORT THE NEWS FULLY, ACCURATELY, AND FAIRLY.

THAT'S DOWN FROM 31% IN 2024.

AND 40% IN JUST 2020.

THIS IS ACCORDING TO A RECENT GALLUP POLL.

WHAT DO YOU THINK IS CAUSING THIS DROP?

CONSERVATIVES SAY IT'S BECAUSE THE MEDIA'S TOO LIBERAL AND DOESN'T PAINT A FAIR PICTURE AND IT'S NOT FAIR.

>> I THINK WHAT'S CAUSED THE DROP IN CONFIDENCE AMONGST REALLY REPUBLICANS HAS BEEN THE WAR THAT DONALD TRUMP AND HIS ALLIES HAVE WAGED AGAINST THE TRUTH FOR THE PAST 10 YEARS.

AND IT'S ACTUALLY GONE LONGER THAN THAT, SINCE RUSH LIMBAUGH ROSE TO POWER ON THE RADIO.

THERE HAS BEEN THIS RELENTLESS ATTACK TO A LARGE PART OF THE COUNTRY THAT JOURNALISTS ARE LYING TO YOU, THEY ARE MISLEADING YOU, AND YOU SHOULD NOT TRUST THE, QUOTE, EXPERTS.

AND I THINK WE REALLY SAW THAT HEIGHTENED DURING COVID WHERE DO NOT TRUST THE EXPERTS, DO NOT TRUST THE SCIENTISTS.

THEY ARE MISLEADING YOU.

THEY HAVE NEFARIOUS INCENTIVES.

NOW, ARE THERE A NUMBER OF OTHER REASONS LIKE PERHAPS THE FRAGMENTATION OF MEDIA BECAUSE OF SOCIAL MEDIA AND ALGORITHMS AND A BUNCH OF OTHER THINGS?

YES.

BUT THAT IS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE POLLS, THE GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT DO NOT TRUST THE MEDIA THE MOST ACCORDING TO THIS GALLUP POLL ARE REPUBLICANS.

THEY HAVE 8% TRUST OF MEDIA.

THAT IS A STARK DIFFERENCE COMPARED TO DEMOCRATS.

>> BEFORE I LET YOU GO, OLIVER, OBVIOUSLY A BIG TOPIC.

WHERE DOES THIS GO NEXT?

WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO LEAVE US WITH?

WHAT SHOULD WE DO?

>> YOU KNOW, THAT'S, I TRY NOT TO BE SO PESSIMISTIC, BUT IT'S DIFFICULT TO LOOK AT THE ENVIRONMENT WE'RE OPERATING IN AND NOT FEEL LIKE THERE IS NO ACTUAL REVERSAL HERE.

I THINK THE ONE GOOD THING IS BECAUSE, AND WE TOUCHED ON THIS, BUT BECAUSE IT HAS NEVER BEEN EASIER TO START INDEPENDENT NEWS ROOMS, I THINK THAT'S THE ONE BRIGHT LIGHT.

AND MY HOPE IS THAT SOME OF THESE INDEPENDENT NEWS ROOMS CAN PICK UP THE TORCH THAT IS BEING SET DOWN BY THEIR, YOU KNOW, MUCH LARGER LEGACY NEWS ORGANIZATIONS AND CARRY THAT FORWARD AND DO SOME GOOD INVESTIGATIVE WORK AND REALLY DO REPORTING.

INCREDIBLY ALARMING THAT AT A MOMENT WHEN YOU WANT NEWS ORGANIZATIONS I THINK TO BE STRONGER THAN EVER, TO HOLD THIS ADMINISTRATION'S FEET TO THE FIRE, TO SPOTLIGHT ABUSES, THEY'RE ACTUALLY AT THEIR MOST VULNERABLE POINTS AND THEY ARE SHRINKING PRETTY RAPIDLY AT THIS POINT.

AND I THINK THAT IS A VERY ALARMING TREND FOR OUR COUNTRY AND FOR OUR DEMOCRACY.

>> OLIVER DARCY, THANKS FOR TALKING WITH US.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME